This thing is really poorly designed and appears to be a common problem with these Kitchenaid / Kenmore washers.
I replaced the entire sump about 7 months ago and now it’s doing it again. Got a warranty replacement sump on the way. Probably just going to rebuild one of the old ones with a new O-ring since now I apparently have 3 of these things in rotation. Pretty unnerving. Nothing but problems with all of my Kenmore appliances.
I just pulled off my diverter motor because it was leaking. Funny thing… Mine doesn’t even have a washer on it! Can I get this washer anywhere by itself?
Same issue, no washer? I just replaced the sump thinking it was the washer that on the inside of the sump that was bad. Where is this other washer?
I too have had a Diverter Motor fail on my Kenmore dishwasher model 665.13269K113 with Diverter Motor #W10476222. The sump for this model is part #W10455268 and contains the sealing grommet between the sump housing and the diverter motor shaft.
I was able to find a replacement sealing grommet without having to buy the entire sump housing. The replacement part is available from **************
The part # is W10195677 and is called Seal-shaft, diverter valve. On the package the part is simply called a Grommet.
I just installed this part in my dishwasher and have run three cycles through it with no leakage.
I hope this info will help others with the same problem.
Also, I noticed a few people indicated that this sealing grommet should go in with the grooved side facing the diverter motor. I do not believe this is correct. The ID of the grommet has a taper to it. Installing it so the groove faces the diverter motor would have the tapered side inside the sump which is going the wrong way. This would also leave a small well for water to lay trapped against the motor shaft and grommet. I do not believe this is the design intent.
Finally, the grommet cost is $5.55, much better than the cost of the replacement sump. I found this by contacting Whirlpool’s spare parts service (**************)
[QUOTE=jp_austin;876003]Yeah I got it fixed. The trick it to remove the seal, I cleaned mine with CLR to remove the gunk inside of it. I flipped it over so the sealing spring/ring is pointing down. I used silicone grease on the shaft. Slide the seal over the shaft all the way down. Then install the diverter. As I stated earlier the connecter for the small switch was essentially gone. I just soldered to the small board directly the wires. The seal goes into the housing but not as deep as if you install it first. That is the trick. The seal being lower on the shaft seals tighter and no more leaks. I have checked on it half a dozen times to make sure it’s still holding up and not a drop. The diverter motor on mine clacks a bit and I may look to see if the internals of the diverter valve are OK. I can hear the water being shuttled between the upper and middle sections now (the job of the diverter) so I think it’s working OK.
The pump on mine slightly shifted over time and it’s slightly hanging down from the housing. I tried to get it back into the original location a couple of times but the design sucks. I used a small piece of foam rubber under the pump motor to push it back up into position and that reduced a lot of the clack noise. Sad that this dishwasher is only three years old but it’s only designed to last at best about four to five years based on the crappy parts being used.[/QUOTE]
I believe jp_austin has found the key solution, i.e. it is necessary to install the seal on the diverter motor shaft first. My seal was also installed incorrectly at the factory. Since I could not find a new seal without purchasing the entire sump assembly, I cleaned and lubricated the original seal and installed per ap_austin’s procedure. It is now leak free for two cycles. Hopefully the seal will not shift over time.
It is hard to believe that Kitchenaid will not at least sell the troublesome seal separately. They have ruined their (and other Whirpool product) reputation with me. Otherwise, we have been pleased with the product (KUDE40FXBL4).
I will also note that the first time this dishwasher leaked I had called a repair shop. They replaced the damaged diverter motor but not the seal. They were also unaware of the seal being installed incorrectly and certainly were not aware of jp_austin’s procedure.
Thank You jp_austin
[QUOTE=jp_austin;876003]Yeah I got it fixed. The trick it to remove the seal, I cleaned mine with CLR to remove the gunk inside of it. I flipped it over so the sealing spring/ring is pointing down. I used silicone grease on the shaft. Slide the seal over the shaft all the way down. Then install the diverter. As I stated earlier the connecter for the small switch was essentially gone. I just soldered to the small board directly the wires. The seal goes into the housing but not as deep as if you install it first. That is the trick. The seal being lower on the shaft seals tighter and no more leaks. I have checked on it half a dozen times to make sure it’s still holding up and not a drop. The diverter motor on mine clacks a bit and I may look to see if the internals of the diverter valve are OK. I can hear the water being shuttled between the upper and middle sections now (the job of the diverter) so I think it’s working OK.
The pump on mine slightly shifted over time and it’s slightly hanging down from the housing. I tried to get it back into the original location a couple of times but the design sucks. I used a small piece of foam rubber under the pump motor to push it back up into position and that reduced a lot of the clack noise. Sad that this dishwasher is only three years old but it’s only designed to last at best about four to five years based on the crappy parts being used.[/QUOTE]
I believe jp_austin has found the key solution, i.e. it is necessary to install the seal on the diverter motor shaft first. My seal was also installed incorrectly at the factory. Since I could not find a new seal without purchasing the entire sump assembly, I cleaned and lubricated the original seal and installed per ap_austin’s procedure. It is now leak free for two cycles. Hopefully the seal will not shift over time.
It is hard to believe that Kitchenaid will not at least sell the troublesome seal separately. They have ruined their (and other Whirpool product) reputation with me. Otherwise, we have been pleased with the product (KUDE40FXBL4).
I will also note that the first time this dishwasher leaked I had called a repair shop. They replaced the damaged diverter motor but not the seal. They were also unaware of the seal being installed incorrectly and certainly were not aware of jp_austin’s procedure.
Thank You jp_austin
MVMusci has the best answer. The parts guys try to sell you the whole sump but all you need is the seal. After I bought and replaced the entire sump part#W10455268 on my Kenmore, I pulled the old seal out and found it to be a whirlpool W10195677 seal. It is about 10% of what I paid for the sump. The seal can be replaced from inside the dishwasher with the sump still installed after the diverter motor is pulled. This would have been much cheaper and easier than replacing the sump. I think I will buy a spare based on how often this problem occurs!
[QUOTE=BR123;893407]MVMusci has the best answer. The parts guys try to sell you the whole sump but all you need is the seal. After I bought and replaced the entire sump part#W10455268 on my Kenmore, I pulled the old seal out and found it to be a whirlpool W10195677 seal. It is about 10% of what I paid for the sump. The seal can be replaced from inside the dishwasher with the sump still installed after the diverter motor is pulled. This would have been much cheaper and easier than replacing the sump. I think I will buy a spare based on how often this problem occurs![/QUOTE]
General Info to Others:
Although the KitchenAid dishwasher is made by Whirlpool and the design looks very similar, the referenced Whirlpool seal did not fit my specific KitchenAid dishwasher. As far as I could determine the only way to purchase the correct size seal my KitchenAid dishwasher is with the entire sump unit.
My dishwasher is still leak free at this point. I had reused the original seal installed per procedures outlined in my initial response to this thread.
Same problem here with a Kitchaide KUDL15FXSS1.
Like everyone else, I am appalled that the manufacturer chooses to design this thing so terribly. Not being able to buy the seal by itself is rotten decision to force you into buying the sump and also a large bill from a repairman. I am a mechanical engineer and stuff like this gives us all a bad name!
In my case the leak has clearly been going on for a while. We just bought the house, so we didn’t see it until there were big puddles on the kitchen floor in the morning. The microswitch on the diverter had completely failed, so I had to buy a new one. I cleaned the corroded contacts on the connectors by scraping them with a small screwdriver. There was also a corroded connector on the pump which needed repair.
I had the whole washer apart about 4 different times. There was no spring behind the seal in mine so that was clearly part of the problem.
While it doesn’t sound right to me to flip the seal over, I won’t argue with success. After trying a number of different things I flipped the seal and put some pressure on it with two 1/16" thick gaskets. I covered everything with a thin layer of silicone plumber’s grease. I’m in my first test run and so far it’s holding. I’m much further than I have been before, so I’m hopeful that it’s fixed. I am a little concerned that there will be too much pressure on the shaft to turn reliably, but I’ll have to wait and see.
Thanks to all for the detailed advice. I’m not sure I would have made it without all the info.
We bought all new Sears Kenmore appliances when we bought this home in April 2012. I installed the dishwasher a few days after we moved in. Our dishwasher is a 665.13263K111 and while we did not pay the list price of $899.99 for it, it certainly has not been a joy to own, failing this soon in it’s life. We left behind all of our Whirlpool Gold appliances in our last home, primarily because they were over 12 years old and it was time to replace them at some point.
Now we appear to have the same problem as everyone who has posted in this thread. Noting that the experience of most posters appears to be at the three year time frame, I guess our experience with this Kenmore / Whirlpool trash is not unusual.
I took the diverter motor off and the pump to ensure that there were no obvious cracks or other problems that might have contributed to the small amount of leakage; - about 6 oz during a complete cycle. The diverter looked OK, but I cleaned the contacts that had started to turn blue with vinegar, a toothbrush and electronics parts cleaner followed by canned air. Contacts seemed to clean up well.
The machine sits on ceramic tile flooring, and the water got in the grout and flowed under some of the tiles. It ruined the cabinet toe kicks as they swelled and split due to the excessive water damage. The only sealing was an ‘o’ ring inside the sump where the shaft enters the sump.
There was no washer or other seals that I could see. Haven’t run it yet to see if it is better, worse or just OK. Waiting for the silicone to dry up inside the sump housing in the ‘o’ ring area.
If someone is considering a class action law suit against Kitchenaid, Whirlpool and Sears, I’m in.
Three years from a $900 appliance is unacceptable. Used to be the quality went in before the name went on according to Zenith. Now you have to pay more for an extended warranty to fix the cheaped-out appliance when it breaks, which apparently is inevitable.
Canon_Man
[COLOR=“Blue”]The machine sits on ceramic tile flooring, and the water got in the grout and flowed under some of the tiles. It ruined the cabinet toe kicks as they swelled and split due to the excessive water damage.[/COLOR]
I would recommend you do the following.
Buy yourself a tray. The plastic ones they sell for wet boots or similar will do.
They have about a half inch lip all around the outside. Try to get the largest one you can that will still fit under the unit. You want to cover as many possible leak points as can.
Then cut about an inch out of the front side lip out.
Either do not have the units kick plate touching the floor or cut a small piece out where it meets the floor.
So now if the pump etc.leaks the water will run out onto the floor in front of the unit and you will know that there is a problem.
Often the tray will not get under the water valve so either get a small tray for here or as I do just double up some tin foil and make a seperate one for that area.
That’s a good work around. I actually ran it last night and of course it continued to leak around the ‘diverter’ gizmo as before. :mad: I placed a small, low tuperware 12 oz container at the center of the unit where it leaks and caught about 6 oz of water; - none on the floor thankfully.
I plan to run the unit until it quits and then take it to Sears with a sign on it and plunk it in their main floor store area. One can only hope that Sears, along with their crappy goods go out of business quietly.
Don’t get Consumers Reports anymore, but I think we’ll replace it with a Miele or Bosch unit. That way if something does go wrong, I won’t hesitate to repair or have it repaired as a higher end unit.
Well, it leaked after I took it apart to see where the leak was.
As mentioned, I put it back together, added a small amount of silicone up in the sump where the ‘o’ ring seal was and re-positioned the ‘diverter’.
What was a leak subsided after 24 hours, with a trickle coming out with the next run, and finally nothing at all.
Now I guess I’ve got a dishwasher that works, doesn’t leak, but is a ticking time bomb.
I don’t even know what this ‘diverter’ does, or how this shaft does anything, because it doesn’t turn as far as I can tell.
Mystery to me!
Canon_Man
Here is a link to a manual which may be useful to you.
You will have to join the site and be logged in to be able to download it.
http://appliancejunk.com/forums/index.php?action=downloads;sa=downfile&id=229;t=1450702906
I do not have a Kenmore to Whirlpool model cross reference list so do not know if this is an exact match to your unit but the pump looks the same.
Hi,
Will have a look after the Christmas rush is over…
Thanks again.
[quote=denman;894991]Canon_Man
Here is a link to a manual which may be useful to you.
You will have to join the site and be logged in to be able to download it.
http://appliancejunk.com/forums/index.php?action=downloads;sa=downfile&id=229;t=1450702906
I do not have a Kenmore to Whirlpool model cross reference list so do not know if this is an exact match to your unit but the pump looks the same.[/quote]
This thread explains how I finally, (with some effort and too much time on my hands!) fixed our dishwasher for now.
not to mention cabinet/floor repairs.
[QUOTE=Canon_Man;894757]We bought all new Sears Kenmore appliances when we bought this home in April 2012. I installed the dishwasher a few days after we moved in. Our dishwasher is a 665.13263K111 and while we did not pay the list price of $899.99 for it, it certainly has not been a joy to own, failing this soon in it’s life. We left behind all of our Whirlpool Gold appliances in our last home, primarily because they were over 12 years old and it was time to replace them at some point.
Now we appear to have the same problem as everyone who has posted in this thread. Noting that the experience of most posters appears to be at the three year time frame, I guess our experience with this Kenmore / Whirlpool trash is not unusual.
I took the diverter motor off and the pump to ensure that there were no obvious cracks or other problems that might have contributed to the small amount of leakage; - about 6 oz during a complete cycle. The diverter looked OK, but I cleaned the contacts that had started to turn blue with vinegar, a toothbrush and electronics parts cleaner followed by canned air. Contacts seemed to clean up well.
The machine sits on ceramic tile flooring, and the water got in the grout and flowed under some of the tiles. It ruined the cabinet toe kicks as they swelled and split due to the excessive water damage. The only sealing was an ‘o’ ring inside the sump where the shaft enters the sump.
There was no washer or other seals that I could see. Haven’t run it yet to see if it is better, worse or just OK. Waiting for the silicone to dry up inside the sump housing in the ‘o’ ring area.
If someone is considering a class action law suit against Kitchenaid, Whirlpool and Sears, I’m in.
Three years from a $900 appliance is unacceptable. Used to be the quality went in before the name went on according to Zenith. Now you have to pay more for an extended warranty to fix the cheaped-out appliance when it breaks, which apparently is inevitable.[/QUOTE]
not to mention the price and time spent with
cabinet/floor repairs
I have the same problem with my Kenmore 665.12793k311 leaking at the dirverter motor. I read all the reviews on Sears website before buying the unit and saying it won’t happen to me but it did! The washer is only 1.5 years old and Sears doesn’t care about my flooded kitchen, or the defective parts without lots of $ paid to there service tech. they suck! Well anyway, I was wondering who came to the conclusion that the sump seal for the diverter valve shaft is installed upside down? I see lots of post here and other blogs stating this. Was there a tech bulletin from Whirlpool or Sears? I just want to know what way it needs to be installed since I removed it from the sump so I could replace it. I would assume that the side of the seal with the spring would be facing the motor or away from the wet environment of the inside of the sump. The spring is a cheap stainless since it will stick to a magnet meaning that in the hot,wet, and caustic conditions of the sump it probably won’t last to long. So if someone can jump in and let me know what way it goes I would appreciate it. In addition where is the best place to buy that seal online.
Thanks in advance
George
Have seen the seal on Amazon for about $12, but if you can get your hands on some small opaque surgical rubber/neoprene tubing it will slip over the shaft and seal the offending seal very well. Add a bit of silicone grease and you’re good.