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chiefengineer1  
#1 Posted : Saturday, February 25, 2023 1:25:12 PM(UTC)
chiefengineer1

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I have checked every thermostat and cutoff. Dryer
element glows bright when I crank the dryer and
have the element in its housing wired-dangling
not touching any other part of the dryer. The second
it touches metal on the unit, as it normally would
installed and screwed in, it never heats. What to
check next?
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ThatGuy  
#2 Posted : Saturday, February 25, 2023 3:20:51 PM(UTC)
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Is the element shorted to its metal shell?

Do you have 240 volts AC to the dryer and is it 120 and 120 volts (either side to neutral)(240 volts across the left and right terminals) with the neutral in the center?

Is there 240 across both terminals of the element? Or only 120?

I suspect a voltage or grounding problem.
chiefengineer1  
#3 Posted : Sunday, February 26, 2023 9:51:06 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ThatGuy Go to Quoted Post
Is the element shorted to its metal shell?

Do you have 240 volts AC to the dryer and is it 120 and 120 volts (either side to neutral)(240 volts across the left and right terminals) with the neutral in the center?

Is there 240 across both terminals of the element? Or only 120?

I suspect a voltage or grounding problem.


First, I am grateful you took an interest in this problem. Here is
how I tested the voltage to this dryer (it is 240V): the three terminals
to the wall supply are as follows: 2 hots on the outside, and a neutral
in the middle which is grounded to the body of the dryer with a short white wire
(these check out 120V apiece); the element has two reds which each carry
120V when touched to the dryer body or element housing when it is installed (
I unplug one lead at a time as I presume one goes to the motor and the other
to the timer); the orange in the middle of the element sensor seems irrelevant.

The voltage all checks out but the element only lights when not touching metal.
The only other part of this unit that is questionable is a door switch that I replaced
ten years back that has failed again...the drum rolls with the door open...perhaps
I do not see how that might ground out the element(?)

The unit cycles fast without heat and works the same with the cycle sensor
either removed or jumpered together. All the other sensors have continuity. I
feel like there is an incinerated wire somewhere that needs to be
re-installed.


chiefengineer1  
#4 Posted : Sunday, February 26, 2023 9:56:29 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ThatGuy Go to Quoted Post
Is the element shorted to its metal shell?



I forgot to mention: no. It seems like it is which is a mystery.
I get 120V from either element lead to the shell or the dryer body
so I thought it might be coming through the orange lead in the middle.
But it behaves the same without that lead attached.

ThatGuy  
#5 Posted : Sunday, February 26, 2023 11:42:44 AM(UTC)
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On the element you should get 240 across the two terminals. If you don't, that's the problem. The element has to have 240 to heat.

The power goes through the terminals strip, to the timer, to the temperature switch (if you have one), through the thermostats, through the high limit (on the element), through the element, through the motor start switch and back to the terminal strip.

I wrote this from memory, so it might not be 100% accurate. :) I've been retired for over ten years and I volunteer sometimes to try and help people. This site used to be very active, then something happened. I don't know what, but now its mostly dead and broken. I still come here and try to help, if I think I can.

What kind of a reading do you get from the element (disconnected) to the dryer? Un-powered there should be zero continuity and when powered, no voltage.
chiefengineer1  
#6 Posted : Monday, February 27, 2023 10:47:14 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ThatGuy Go to Quoted Post
On the element you should get 240 across the two terminals. If you don't, that's the problem. The element has to have 240 to heat.

......

What kind of a reading do you get from the element (disconnected) to the dryer? Un-powered there should be zero continuity and when powered, no voltage.


CASE A: With the unit plugged in and OFF:
1)There is continuity across the element terminals (beeping on multi-meter)
2)There is also continuity from either terminal to the body of the unit
3)120V from one terminal to body of unit, also 120V from other terminal to body
4)0V from terminal to terminal

CASE B: With the unit plugged in an ON:
1)Exactly as 1-4 (above)

CASE C: With the orange wire unplugged from the high limit (on the element) and plugged in but no power:

1)There is continuity across the element terminals (beeping on multi-meter)
2)There is NO continuity from either terminal to the body of the unit
3)There is no measurable voltage from the terminals to each other or the unit body

CASE D: With the orange wire unplugged from the high limit (on the element) and plugged and power ON:

1)There is continuity or voltage across the element terminals (beeping on multi-meter)
2)There is continuity AND 120V voltage from either terminal to the body of the unit
3)There is no measurable voltage from the terminals to each other



CASE E: With the unit plugged in, OFF, and the heater element housing dangling free
with all wires attached but not touching the dryer housing:

1)Result is exactly as CASE C (above).

CASE F: With the unit plugged in, ON, and the heater element housing dangling free
with all wires attached but not touching the dryer housing:

1) In the past the element has heated every time, but I could not replicate this
within 15 minutes...perhaps there was nothing in the dryer...I cannot find a
moisture sensor on this unit and it is empty...I assume it would eventually light up
and I am glad it didn't because it gets so hot so fast testing the rest of the way
would get have to stop.
2) Continuity only between the element terminals.
3) Continuity and voltage between each element terminal and the housing
of the dryer (not the part dangling free)...120V from each terminal.



CASE G: With the unit plugged in, OFF, and the heater element housing dangling free
with all but the orange wire attached but not touching the dryer housing:

1)Result is exactly like CASES C,E (above)

CASE H: With the unit plugged in, ON, and the heater element housing dangling free
with all but the orange wire attached but not touching the dryer housing:

1)Result is exactly like CASES C,E,G (above)

Bottom line is this: there is continuity AND voltage powered or unpowered
in the unit's standard state from the element to the housing. The only way to create an exception to this is (without detaching the element housing) if the orange wire is disconnected and the unit off. Then there is zero continuity to the dryer housing.

Hope this helps. I am getting ready to buy another dryer but it seems like
everything but one detail is missing in this puzzle.







ThatGuy  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, February 28, 2023 10:31:55 AM(UTC)
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Watch this video and see if it helps.



What I look for is 240 at the element terminals. If its not there... you need to trace back through and find out what is stopping it. Like in the video, Timer set on timed dry, temp. control on high(if you have one), and dryer running. Just be really careful.. 240 volts is dangerous.

I wish I could magically appear there. I could tell you what is wrong with it in 30 minutes. Its hard to convey testing like this through written text.
thanks 1 user thanked ThatGuy for this useful post.
chiefengineer1 on 3/2/2023(UTC)
chiefengineer1  
#8 Posted : Thursday, March 2, 2023 8:16:36 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ThatGuy Go to Quoted Post
Watch this video and see if it helps.



Thank-you immensely. That was the best video I have seen and I
have reviewed dozens. It IS/WAS no 240V in the control dial.
An actuator arm inside had gotten munged. From what I could tell
it's purpose in life was to shim the dial. Without it there is
240V across the terminals, and the rest of the dryer tests fine.

The only problem is that withput it if I attach the drive motor the gears are
no longer shimmed. But manually it tests great, albeit on the "low
heat setting" although it seems to get the full 9 yards.

Do you know if the cycling sensor or the high limit switch
report to the dial, or simply break power where they reside
in the unit? I am looking for a cheap source for a dial in the interim...the
local shops want half the cost of new dryer.

ThatGuy  
#9 Posted : Thursday, March 2, 2023 12:39:41 PM(UTC)
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Is this the part you are talking about?

https://www.appliancepar...w10185972-ap6016537.html

I think you are describing burnt contacts inside the timer. You need to replace the timer. They are cheaper on ebay and amazon. part no. WPW10185972
chiefengineer1  
#10 Posted : Friday, March 3, 2023 12:01:43 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ThatGuy Go to Quoted Post
Is this the part you are talking about?

https://www.appliancepar...w10185972-ap6016537.html

I think you are describing burnt contacts inside the timer. You need to replace the timer. They are cheaper on ebay and amazon. part no. WPW10185972


Yes, and more specifically, I took the motor off the back of the timer and opened it up and cleaned the contacts. Inside the timer there were three polypropylene "armatures" driving about 7 copper "wands" that had contacts. I cleaned those contacts and the voltage became intermittent because the tolerances were so fine. One of the armatures was simply worn and actually interfering with turning the mechanism. I believe it's purpose was so that when you plugged the actuator motor on the back of the timer it kept the gear wheels stable in the enclosure.

The motor actuator works fine but is turning nothing presently, and the timer works partially without one of the arms. I am replacing them all because I don't see where I can get them separately. In reality it looks like a 10 cent piece of plastic is what I need. My fear is that running the unit manually without a motor turning the timer prevents cycling the heater on and off...thus my test dried three big wet towels in less than 5 minutes.

Do you think I am right about that...not that it matters, but I may want to dry something before the part comes?
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