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zeebee  
#21 Posted : Tuesday, July 28, 2015 1:41:47 PM(UTC)
zeebee

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This thing is really poorly designed and appears to be a common problem with these Kitchenaid / Kenmore washers.

I replaced the entire sump about 7 months ago and now it's doing it again. Got a warranty replacement sump on the way. Probably just going to rebuild one of the old ones with a new O-ring since now I apparently have 3 of these things in rotation. Pretty unnerving. Nothing but problems with all of my Kenmore appliances.
zlarson  
#22 Posted : Friday, August 7, 2015 10:31:09 AM(UTC)
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I just pulled off my diverter motor because it was leaking. Funny thing.... Mine doesn't even have a washer on it! Can I get this washer anywhere by itself?
jpjohnson  
#23 Posted : Thursday, September 17, 2015 6:19:05 PM(UTC)
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Same issue, no washer? I just replaced the sump thinking it was the washer that on the inside of the sump that was bad. Where is this other washer?
MVMusci  
#24 Posted : Friday, September 25, 2015 7:07:57 PM(UTC)
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I too have had a Diverter Motor fail on my Kenmore dishwasher model #665.13269K113 with Diverter Motor #W10476222. The sump for this model is part #W10455268 and contains the sealing grommet between the sump housing and the diverter motor shaft.
I was able to find a replacement sealing grommet without having to buy the entire sump housing. The replacement part is available from ************** Cooling, Appliance at 1-877-827-5003.
The part # is W10195677 and is called Seal-shaft, diverter valve. On the package the part is simply called a Grommet.
I just installed this part in my dishwasher and have run three cycles through it with no leakage.
I hope this info will help others with the same problem.
Also, I noticed a few people indicated that this sealing grommet should go in with the grooved side facing the diverter motor. I do not believe this is correct. The ID of the grommet has a taper to it. Installing it so the groove faces the diverter motor would have the tapered side inside the sump which is going the wrong way. This would also leave a small well for water to lay trapped against the motor shaft and grommet. I do not believe this is the design intent.
Finally, the grommet cost is $5.55, much better than the cost of the replacement sump. I found this by contacting Whirlpool's spare parts service (**************) from a number on Whirlpools website.
Curt100  
#25 Posted : Friday, October 30, 2015 5:47:07 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: jp_austin Go to Quoted Post
Yeah I got it fixed. The trick it to remove the seal, I cleaned mine with CLR to remove the gunk inside of it. I flipped it over so the sealing spring/ring is pointing down. I used silicone grease on the shaft. Slide the seal over the shaft all the way down. Then install the diverter. As I stated earlier the connecter for the small switch was essentially gone. I just soldered to the small board directly the wires. The seal goes into the housing but not as deep as if you install it first. That is the trick. The seal being lower on the shaft seals tighter and no more leaks. I have checked on it half a dozen times to make sure it's still holding up and not a drop. The diverter motor on mine clacks a bit and I may look to see if the internals of the diverter valve are OK. I can hear the water being shuttled between the upper and middle sections now (the job of the diverter) so I think it's working OK.

The pump on mine slightly shifted over time and it's slightly hanging down from the housing. I tried to get it back into the original location a couple of times but the design sucks. I used a small piece of foam rubber under the pump motor to push it back up into position and that reduced a lot of the clack noise. Sad that this dishwasher is only three years old but it's only designed to last at best about four to five years based on the crappy parts being used.

I believe jp_austin has found the key solution, i.e. it is necessary to install the seal on the diverter motor shaft first. My seal was also installed incorrectly at the factory. Since I could not find a new seal without purchasing the entire sump assembly, I cleaned and lubricated the original seal and installed per ap_austin's procedure. It is now leak free for two cycles. Hopefully the seal will not shift over time.

It is hard to believe that Kitchenaid will not at least sell the troublesome seal separately. They have ruined their (and other Whirpool product) reputation with me. Otherwise, we have been pleased with the product (KUDE40FXBL4).

I will also note that the first time this dishwasher leaked I had called a repair shop. They replaced the damaged diverter motor but not the seal. They were also unaware of the seal being installed incorrectly and certainly were not aware of jp_austin's procedure.

Thank You jp_austin
Curt100  
#26 Posted : Friday, October 30, 2015 5:48:06 AM(UTC)
Curt100

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Originally Posted by: jp_austin Go to Quoted Post
Yeah I got it fixed. The trick it to remove the seal, I cleaned mine with CLR to remove the gunk inside of it. I flipped it over so the sealing spring/ring is pointing down. I used silicone grease on the shaft. Slide the seal over the shaft all the way down. Then install the diverter. As I stated earlier the connecter for the small switch was essentially gone. I just soldered to the small board directly the wires. The seal goes into the housing but not as deep as if you install it first. That is the trick. The seal being lower on the shaft seals tighter and no more leaks. I have checked on it half a dozen times to make sure it's still holding up and not a drop. The diverter motor on mine clacks a bit and I may look to see if the internals of the diverter valve are OK. I can hear the water being shuttled between the upper and middle sections now (the job of the diverter) so I think it's working OK.

The pump on mine slightly shifted over time and it's slightly hanging down from the housing. I tried to get it back into the original location a couple of times but the design sucks. I used a small piece of foam rubber under the pump motor to push it back up into position and that reduced a lot of the clack noise. Sad that this dishwasher is only three years old but it's only designed to last at best about four to five years based on the crappy parts being used.

I believe jp_austin has found the key solution, i.e. it is necessary to install the seal on the diverter motor shaft first. My seal was also installed incorrectly at the factory. Since I could not find a new seal without purchasing the entire sump assembly, I cleaned and lubricated the original seal and installed per ap_austin's procedure. It is now leak free for two cycles. Hopefully the seal will not shift over time.

It is hard to believe that Kitchenaid will not at least sell the troublesome seal separately. They have ruined their (and other Whirpool product) reputation with me. Otherwise, we have been pleased with the product (KUDE40FXBL4).

I will also note that the first time this dishwasher leaked I had called a repair shop. They replaced the damaged diverter motor but not the seal. They were also unaware of the seal being installed incorrectly and certainly were not aware of jp_austin's procedure.

Thank You jp_austin
BR123  
#27 Posted : Saturday, October 31, 2015 9:52:07 AM(UTC)
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MVMusci has the best answer. The parts guys try to sell you the whole sump but all you need is the seal. After I bought and replaced the entire sump part#W10455268 on my Kenmore, I pulled the old seal out and found it to be a whirlpool W10195677 seal. It is about 10% of what I paid for the sump. The seal can be replaced from inside the dishwasher with the sump still installed after the diverter motor is pulled. This would have been much cheaper and easier than replacing the sump. I think I will buy a spare based on how often this problem occurs!
Curt100  
#28 Posted : Tuesday, November 10, 2015 1:33:25 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: BR123 Go to Quoted Post
MVMusci has the best answer. The parts guys try to sell you the whole sump but all you need is the seal. After I bought and replaced the entire sump part#W10455268 on my Kenmore, I pulled the old seal out and found it to be a whirlpool W10195677 seal. It is about 10% of what I paid for the sump. The seal can be replaced from inside the dishwasher with the sump still installed after the diverter motor is pulled. This would have been much cheaper and easier than replacing the sump. I think I will buy a spare based on how often this problem occurs!


General Info to Others:
Although the KitchenAid dishwasher is made by Whirlpool and the design looks very similar, the referenced Whirlpool seal did not fit my specific KitchenAid dishwasher. As far as I could determine the only way to purchase the correct size seal my KitchenAid dishwasher is with the entire sump unit.

My dishwasher is still leak free at this point. I had reused the original seal installed per procedures outlined in my initial response to this thread.
iggogg  
#29 Posted : Sunday, December 6, 2015 8:41:14 AM(UTC)
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Same problem here with a Kitchaide KUDL15FXSS1.

Like everyone else, I am appalled that the manufacturer chooses to design this thing so terribly. Not being able to buy the seal by itself is rotten decision to force you into buying the sump and also a large bill from a repairman. I am a mechanical engineer and stuff like this gives us all a bad name!

In my case the leak has clearly been going on for a while. We just bought the house, so we didn't see it until there were big puddles on the kitchen floor in the morning. The microswitch on the diverter had completely failed, so I had to buy a new one. I cleaned the corroded contacts on the connectors by scraping them with a small screwdriver. There was also a corroded connector on the pump which needed repair.

I had the whole washer apart about 4 different times. There was no spring behind the seal in mine so that was clearly part of the problem.

While it doesn't sound right to me to flip the seal over, I won't argue with success. After trying a number of different things I flipped the seal and put some pressure on it with two 1/16" thick gaskets. I covered everything with a thin layer of silicone plumber's grease. I'm in my first test run and so far it's holding. I'm much further than I have been before, so I'm hopeful that it's fixed. I am a little concerned that there will be too much pressure on the shaft to turn reliably, but I'll have to wait and see.

Thanks to all for the detailed advice. I'm not sure I would have made it without all the info.
Canon_Man  
#30 Posted : Sunday, December 13, 2015 3:35:13 PM(UTC)
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We bought all new Sears Kenmore appliances when we bought this home in April 2012. I installed the dishwasher a few days after we moved in. Our dishwasher is a 665.13263K111 and while we did not pay the list price of $899.99 for it, it certainly has not been a joy to own, failing this soon in it's life. We left behind all of our Whirlpool Gold appliances in our last home, primarily because they were over 12 years old and it was time to replace them at some point.

Now we appear to have the same problem as everyone who has posted in this thread. Noting that the experience of most posters appears to be at the three year time frame, I guess our experience with this Kenmore / Whirlpool trash is not unusual.

I took the diverter motor off and the pump to ensure that there were no obvious cracks or other problems that might have contributed to the small amount of leakage; - about 6 oz during a complete cycle. The diverter looked OK, but I cleaned the contacts that had started to turn blue with vinegar, a toothbrush and electronics parts cleaner followed by canned air. Contacts seemed to clean up well.

The machine sits on ceramic tile flooring, and the water got in the grout and flowed under some of the tiles. It ruined the cabinet toe kicks as they swelled and split due to the excessive water damage. The only sealing was an 'o' ring inside the sump where the shaft enters the sump.

There was no washer or other seals that I could see. Haven't run it yet to see if it is better, worse or just OK. Waiting for the silicone to dry up inside the sump housing in the 'o' ring area.

If someone is considering a class action law suit against Kitchenaid, Whirlpool and Sears, I'm in.

Three years from a $900 appliance is unacceptable. Used to be the quality went in before the name went on according to Zenith. Now you have to pay more for an extended warranty to fix the cheaped-out appliance when it breaks, which apparently is inevitable.
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