Customer Support 7 days a week

Welcome Guest! You can not login or register.

Notification

Icon
Error

2 Pages12>
Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
Steveor  
#1 Posted : Wednesday, June 11, 2014 7:20:22 PM(UTC)
Steveor

Rank: Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 1/3/2010(UTC)
Posts: 9

Long explanation, so get comfortable. Incidentally, this topic was covered in a pay forum in this link but my subscription just expired so I can't post until I give more cash.

My old washer isn't cycling properly. Washer will not start in any of the fill cycles. Machine comes to life only when I advance the knob near the end of the wash cycle (I believe around step 19 in the timer cycle chart below). It goes through the rinse and spin cycle but gushes water throughout until the end of the complete wash cycle, ie no spin, no spray.

Prior to this I replaced the timer with a used timer because the old timer motor was bad. I'm pretty sure it isn't the replacement timer because I swapped the timer's motor and put it in the old timer and the cycling issue was exactly the same. I even went through the exhaustive process of testing the continuity of every single cam switch in the timer. I also checked the continuity of every connection I could manage in the control panel. They all check out.

So I checked the water level pressure switch using this link as a guide. It too was bad (sheesh!). Running a jumper from the high level to the low level (tan wire to the pink/white wire in the below schematic) engaged the washer's fill process and enabled me to do a few loads until the replacement came. But once I replaced the water level pressure switch I still had no luck starting the wash cycle. I tested the new switch and it passes muster.

I'm thinking my control board is bad and I've begun to have issues with warm water coming in when I've selected all cold. Would the faulty board interfere with the proper cycling? Any idea how to test it to confirm suspected badness?

Thanks, Steve

UserPostedImage
UserPostedImage
Sponsor
See inside of your appliance - diagrams and part photos for virtually every model.

powered by AppliancePartsPros.com
 
fairbank56  
#2 Posted : Thursday, June 12, 2014 8:05:10 AM(UTC)
fairbank56

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Expert
Joined: 10/16/2012(UTC)
Posts: 3,806

Was thanked: 7 time(s) in 7 post(s)
Originally Posted by: Steveor Go to Quoted Post
Running a jumper from the high level to the low level (tan wire to the pink/white wire in the below schematic) engaged the washer's fill process and enabled me to do a few loads until the replacement came.


Something seems amiss with the wiring between pressure switch, ETC-DTC board and timer. Jumping pressure switch tan wire to pink wire should not cause the washer to start filling with timer set to wash fill. Was this washer working ok before or is it a new to you machine? Your symptoms seem to vary so it's difficult for me to even know what they are. You said initially that it filled ok but timer would not advance. You replaced timer and now it won't fill properly with either timer???

Eric
Steveor  
#3 Posted : Thursday, June 12, 2014 11:34:15 AM(UTC)
Steveor

Rank: Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 1/3/2010(UTC)
Posts: 9

Hi Eric,
Thanks for your continued assistance on this issue.

The machine has been running normally for years but the very first issue was my wife telling me it was stuck on a cycle and would not advance. She dealt with it for a day or so until it totally screwed up and flooded. Once I jumped in I saw that the timer motor wasn't running. But in the mean time the water pressure level switch seemed to be functional. At the time I didn't know how all these systems interact so I figured a new timer would do the trick.

New timer installed and the cycles advance if I can get them to start. You assisted me in diagnosing the water pressure level switch and I was able to confirm it was bad or at least intermittenly bad.

During this time the water temp selection started screwing up. Warm water would come in when I had all cold selected. I haven't accurately figured out a pattern on that yet. We rarely use hot and warm wash anyway so I hoped I could just turn off the hot water at the source and just adapt.

I'm perplexed why my machine is acting this way. I've pored over the chart and the schematic and the machine is acting inconsistent with what it should be doing. For example, in attempting a normal wash cycle the machine starts, as best I can estimate, at Step 22. It immediately agitates and water fills to the appropriate level. (This was before I got the new water level pressure switch. Since I received the new one yesterday, it seems to be doing the same thing but I haven't had the time to run as many cycles with the new one.) About two mintutes later, the water drains out and after the water level drops it starts to spin and fill with water while simultaneously draining. It then does this until the end of Step 26, pretty close to 8 minutes which is consistent with the chart. No Spray as would be expected in Step 24 and continuous water coming and draining. Then it stops and will not go to 2nd rinse even if I make that selection.

I mapped out the circuitry in Steps 13 (beginning of normal wash cycle), Step 26 (end of normal wash cycle) and Step 27 (beginning of 2nd rinse). I can post them when I get home later today if that will help. One thing that is consistent with Steps 13 and 27 is that the circuit goes through switches 5 and 7 to the motor's start solenoid. Could that be the issue? I'm not too familliar with how the centrifugal switch and the motor interact with each other. So I could be totally off with this.

Another thing I don't understand is why the water keeps pumping in through Step 26. The chart indicates switch 12 to the cold water valve is ON in these steps. I assume the water level switch should cut off this path in the circuitry. At what point does the water level switch flip from empty? Maybe my water level switch is bad (it is a used part with a warranty). But it seems to work according to the method suggested in the link above.

Thanks again,
Steve
fairbank56  
#4 Posted : Thursday, June 12, 2014 1:22:55 PM(UTC)
fairbank56

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Expert
Joined: 10/16/2012(UTC)
Posts: 3,806

Was thanked: 7 time(s) in 7 post(s)
Power to the drive motor has nothing to do with wash/rinse fill. The washer should not agitate and fill at the same time at step 22. At that point, there is no power to the timer or drive motor until washer fills to the point the the pressure switch goes from empty to full. Is the washer filling via the mix valve or the normal hot/cold valves? Disconnect mix valve to determine.

Eric
Steveor  
#5 Posted : Thursday, June 12, 2014 5:14:57 PM(UTC)
Steveor

Rank: Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 1/3/2010(UTC)
Posts: 9

Originally Posted by: fairbank56 Go to Quoted Post
Is the washer filling via the mix valve or the normal hot/cold valves? Disconnect mix valve to determine.

Eric


Water comes in via hot/cold valves.
Steveor  
#6 Posted : Thursday, June 12, 2014 8:32:25 PM(UTC)
Steveor

Rank: Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 1/3/2010(UTC)
Posts: 9

When I jump the violet with the pink/white and run the washer from Step 13 the water comes through the mix valve but not the cold water or the detergent dispenser.
fairbank56  
#7 Posted : Friday, June 13, 2014 4:00:09 AM(UTC)
fairbank56

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Expert
Joined: 10/16/2012(UTC)
Posts: 3,806

Was thanked: 7 time(s) in 7 post(s)
Too confusing. There are two water inlet valve assemblies. The main one is where the hot and cold water hoses are connected. It has three solenoid operated valves on it, HOT COLD and MIX. If either the hot or cold valve is activated, water comes directly through the fill funnel. If the mix valve is activated, water (warm, equal hot/cold) is sent over to the other valve assembly which also has three solenoid operated valves on it, BLEACH FAB.SOFTENER and DETERGENT. Disconnect the wiring connector from the mix valve. Set temp to cold/cold (non-ETC) and see if water comes in. The ETC/DTC board has a relay on it that prevents water coming in via normal hot/cold valves for the first two minutes of wash cycle. During this time, timer contacts activate the mix valve and the relay activates the detergent valve. This flushes the detergent into the tub before normal fill operation. After two minutes, the relay switches the detergent valve off and applies power to the temp switch for normal hot/cold fill to begin. This two minute delay is determined by circuitry on the board. With mix valve disconnected, you should not see water for the first two minutes. If water never comes on after that, the board/relay may be faulty. It can be jumped out to determine if this is the case. Unplug board and jump wiring connector pins 5 and 7 with a suitable jumper wire.

Does the washer fill in soak cycle?

Eric
Steveor  
#8 Posted : Friday, June 13, 2014 5:31:36 PM(UTC)
Steveor

Rank: Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 1/3/2010(UTC)
Posts: 9

After disconnecting the mix valve the water never came in after two+ minutes. I removed the board and jumped 5 and 7 but the machine would only start in spin mode. Perhaps a few more jumps would get it going? My schematic got wet and crumpled against the case and prevents me from deciphering the other board connections.

It seems like a good guess that the board is bad though. Further evidence is jumping 4 and 6 enabled the detergent dispenser to fill when I could get the cycle going in Step 13 by jumping violet and pink/white. And since I've been dealing with all of this, warm water recently started coming out when cold/cold was selected. For $5 I'll have another one in about five days.

Kind of weird that the timer motor, water level switch and the board have all gone bad. Maybe I fried the board with all my tinkering.

For the sake of clarity and posterity, I was wrong about starting the machine at Step 22 and it agitating. It actually starts at Step 19, agitates for a while, drains (but no bleach dispensing) and then stops cold. I can't get Step 22 going at all. I can get the machine to start at Step 23 and it simultaneously spins, fills and drains for 8 minutes and shuts down. It seems there is an issue when the machine needs to transition between agitate and spin.

What do the boxed X's signify in the schematic? The schematic's legend was pulped and unreadable.
fairbank56  
#9 Posted : Friday, June 13, 2014 7:12:00 PM(UTC)
fairbank56

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Expert
Joined: 10/16/2012(UTC)
Posts: 3,806

Was thanked: 7 time(s) in 7 post(s)
Nothing else on the board wiring connector needs to be jumped together for normal fill with temp switch set to cold/cold. Only the hot valve circuit goes through the board, the cold valve is operated directly from the temp switch. Perhaps the cold valve is faulty. This is all very easy to trace by taking voltage checks til you find where you are losing power for fill operation. The boxed X's on timer chart mean timer switch may be open or closed (doesn't matter which). I see all schematic connections to the board clearly except for pin 8 which is connected to neutral bus via white wire. The yellow/red wire from the cold valve solenoid connects to temp switch D and E as well as to timer contact 12 (rinse fill). There is no reason for washer to be filling at step 23 unless timer is faulty. There should be no power to violet or pink wire of pressure switch at step 23. There is a spray function at step 24 via timer contact 13 but after that there should be 4 minutes of drain/spin without any additional filling.

Eric
Steveor  
#10 Posted : Monday, June 16, 2014 7:33:54 AM(UTC)
Steveor

Rank: Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 1/3/2010(UTC)
Posts: 9

"Life's hard,...but it's harder if you're stupid"

Violet wire was switched with tan wire on water level switch. Dispite taking pictures of everything before disassembly, the orientation of my close up photo of that component led me astray. Classic rookie mistake. Eric, so sorry for wasting your time.

On a positive note, I now know more about my washing machine and its operation than I ever thought I would. Troubleshooting the circuitry eventually enabled me to find my goof and get my machine running again.

A few questions about the cycle sequence chart though. What is the purpose of the angle degrees in the left most column? And could you explain what the column 15/ S.I.S. mix signifies? Lastly, how and why does the machine stop for 3.5 seconds during the various cycles as shown by the diamond symbols between columns 6 and 4?

Thanks again,
Steve
Users browsing this topic
Guest (5)
2 Pages12>
Forum Jump  
You can post new topics in this forum.
You can reply to topics in this forum.
You can delete your posts in this forum.
You can edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You can vote in polls in this forum.