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cronaldallen  
#1 Posted : Friday, July 25, 2014 9:20:25 AM(UTC)
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cronaldallen

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I Just replaced the transmission brake assembly due to a very loud (dry bearing) sound. While in there I replaced bearing split ring, the tub bearing, tub bearing washer, and tub seal.

When I was re-installing the spin basket, I noticed that when I tightened the left handed nut (with spanner wrench), that the spin basket became very rigid. It didn't seem normal, but I finished putting the machine back together, and when I ran it to test it, sure enough, the basket didn't move, and the motor produced a hum (like it was trying to start it spinning, but couldn't).

I powered it back off so I wouldn't damage the motor, but I am wondering what I may have done wrong.

I am usually pretty good with repairing things. For many years, I have been a service plumber and AC tech, and have worked on many appliances, but I have never actually been an appliance tech.

Any input would be appreciated!

Thanks.
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fairbank56  
#2 Posted : Friday, July 25, 2014 10:30:21 AM(UTC)
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fairbank56

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Not sure what you mean by "basket became very rigid". It's supposed to be locked to the transmission shaft. Take the basket back out and run in spin without it. The entire transmission should rotate while in spin. If it won't, then something is binding. Either the tub bearing or you got the brake pad out of alignment.

Eric
cronaldallen  
#3 Posted : Friday, July 25, 2014 4:08:43 PM(UTC)
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cronaldallen

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OK, I will try that tonight. Thanks!
cronaldallen  
#4 Posted : Friday, July 25, 2014 10:49:41 PM(UTC)
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cronaldallen

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So, I removed the spin basket and then put it into a spin cycle. The shaft did not spin, and the motor made sort of a buzzing sound (as if it was trying to start).

So I removed the tub / motor assembly, and flipped it over, and I found that I could easily move the motor pulleys in either direction. In one direction the pulleys simply turned, and in the other direction, the transmission would spin.

So I put the tub / motor assembly back into the machine (without the spin basket), and checking after each step that the pulleys would move freely by hand. I started a spin cycle, and the motor just buzzed without any movement from the shaft or the transmission.

Now this doesn't appear to be associated with the original problem, which was that dry bearing grinding sound (and I am pretty sure that was coming from the brake portion of the transmission / brake assembly - which I replaced), so I concede that it must be something that I induced during my dis-assembly and re-assembly.

As I try to analyze what (in my mind) could be taking place, The only scenario that makes sense to me is that the electric motor is trying to start, and it is unable to, and produces this buzzing sound as it tries unsuccessfully to get the rotor spinning (even though there does not appear to be significant resistance when turning the pulleys by hand).

I see that there is a capacitor attached to the motor (brown plastic secured to the frame just above the motor. Is that a "start" capacitor -or- a "run" capacitor? Is it likely that a failed capacitor could keep the motor from starting? Also, what is the pin-out for the motors' electrical connector? Can I measure the resistance across the motor windings to ensure that the motor itself is good, and if so, where should I take my readings, and what should I consider to be acceptable readings.

Or perhaps I am letting my thoughts take me in the wrong direction. Is there something that I am not considering?

Any input would be appreciated.

Thanks...

Ron
fairbank56  
#5 Posted : Saturday, July 26, 2014 6:04:08 AM(UTC)
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fairbank56

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Yes, that is the start capacitor and could be the problem but it's more likely the motor switch. You can check the switch by checking resistance between the motor terminals where the RED and VIO/WHT wires connect. It should read through the switch and the start winding, about 5.3 ohms. If it's open or very high resistance, the switch is probably faulty. You can check the start winding by itself (not thru switch) by checking resistance between terminal where RED wire connects and the right tab on back of motor (circled in photo below).

UserPostedImage

Eric
cronaldallen  
#6 Posted : Saturday, July 26, 2014 7:13:05 AM(UTC)
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I took the measurement from the terminals where red and violet/white connect (with the connector off) and I read 8.2 ohms. I will have to wait until this evening to get a measurement on the start winding since it appears that I will have to pull the motor out to get to the tab on the back of the motor, but it seems that if I am getting 8 ohms through the switch and the start winding, that the start winding must be OK.

Now you were saying that I should see about 5.3 ohms rather than the 8.2 ohms that I read across the switch, but that seems in the ball park to me (since it isn't 8.2 M ohms or something), or is the tolerance tighter than that?

So, if my thought process is correct about the switch and the start winding being in tact, does that take me back to the start capacitor? I don't know of a way to test a capacitor (short of having a tester that plots the characteristics as the voltage ramps up) other than visually seeing if they are leaking or swollen (which tells you they are bad -not- if they are good).

Should I just get a new capacitor, or should I pull the motor and get a reading on the start winding (have we proved that this is OK or not)?

Thanks for your help on this...

Ron
fairbank56  
#7 Posted : Saturday, July 26, 2014 7:39:25 AM(UTC)
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fairbank56

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Sounds like the switch contacts to me. Your reading is high which indicates the contacts are not in good shape. The problem with a simple static resistance check is that you are only using the low voltage and current of the meter to check. In actual operation, very high starting current must pass through those contacts. A contact can seem to read ok with the meter but fail under actual operating conditions. Turn the motor on (normal cycle spin) and very quickly spin the pulley by hand and it should start. If it won't, check the run winding, orange to blue, should be about 1.6 ohms.

Eric
cronaldallen  
#8 Posted : Saturday, July 26, 2014 8:23:00 AM(UTC)
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cronaldallen

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Well I tried to spin it enough to start it, but I think I was a little intimidated to get my hand in there too far. I wasn't able to get it started, but I did read the resistance on the run winding measuring between the terminals where the blue and the orange wires attach. I read 1.9 ohms. Is that reasonable, or is that too, outside of the tolerance when we pass a real voltage through it?

Also, is the motor switch replaceable, or is that just part of the motor?

Again, thanks for your help!
fairbank56  
#9 Posted : Saturday, July 26, 2014 9:03:11 AM(UTC)
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fairbank56

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You tried hand starting it with the belt off, correct? It should be easy to get it started by hand. If not, there may be some other problem. Disconnect the capacitor and then try hand starting it again. With capacitor connected, you would have to start the rotation in the proper direction but with capacitor disconnected, it doesn't matter. If no go, need to check the voltage at motor connector to make sure your getting 120vac.

The motor switch is not replaceable and this motor is generally not considered serviceable however I have repaired several of them that have motor switch problems. This motor is no longer available and the replacement is very expensive. It is a new type that comes as a kit with motor, relay, capacitor and a pigtail wiring harness that must be connected to your existing wiring.

http://www.appliancepartspros.c...h49x10035-ap3160670.html

Eric
cronaldallen  
#10 Posted : Saturday, July 26, 2014 8:34:33 PM(UTC)
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cronaldallen

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Ok, I pulled the belt off and was able to get it to spin when I started it by hand. It didn't seem to spin very fast, and it produced that buzzing sound, both while trying to spin (and not getting started), as well as while it was spinning (after starting it by hand). It would spin for about 20 seconds, and then the buzzing would stop and the motor would quit spinning.

After about a minute or so, the buzzing would start again, and I was able to start it spinning again (by hand), and it would spin (not very fast) for about 20 seconds again, then the buzzing would stop again as well as the motor.

This doesn't seem to be very encouraging, but perhaps there is still some life left in this.

Eric, I must say that you are extremely knowledgeable and helpful. I appreciate the input and insight that you have offered to me.

Let me know what you think about the results of this last exercise, and if there is anything else that I can do to try and make this motor operational.

Thanks again,

Ron
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