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Dav0  
#1 Posted : Sunday, March 30, 2014 6:53:46 PM(UTC)
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Dav0

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Hi everyone,

We just purchased a used Kenmore elite stove model
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, 'lucida grande', tahoma, verdana, arial, sans-serif]C970-692922[/FONT]
which is from the early 2000's. The person who sold it said the bottom element didn't work and they thought it needed some part between the timer and the element but apart from the bake element everything else on the stove functions correctly.

I took out the bake element and did a continuity test which it passed, however there is a metal bracket that fastens the element to the back of the stove and also connects both of the prongs together so I wasn't sure if maybe it was going through that and creative a false positive though if that were the case then the electricity would also shot out through there you would think.

I connected my multimeter to the two leads which power the bake element, when the power is off it realds about .6v when you turn bake on it reads about 102v. When you turn on the element you can hear the click from inside the top as you would for everything else and there is power being sent according to my multimeter.

Since there is power going there (though is 102v the right ammount?) I think it must be the bake element which is broken but I dont want to go spend $30 on a new one until I know for sure.,

Do you guys think its the bake element or something internal? Is there any other tests I can do?

Thank you guys in advance for any help you can offer.
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denman  
#2 Posted : Monday, March 31, 2014 2:23:33 AM(UTC)
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denman

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The C in the model number usually designates that it is a Canadian model so I do not have access to any info on it.
The 970 designates that it is actually a Frigidaire.

I am assuming that broil works.
Also that the oven stays in preheat (never or takes a long time to come ready)

Below is a manual (US models) but may be useful to you. You will have to join the site and be logged in to be able to download the manual.
http://appliancejunk.com...wnloads;sa=view;down=283

The element rear support bracket is on the outside of the calrod (ceramic) insulation so should not short the element heating wires out.
Use your meters most sensitive resistance scale and re-check the element. It is a good idea to shrt the meter leads together before measuring to see if there is a zero offset in the meter.
Most elements are in the 20 to 30 ohm range.
Checking from the element connectors to the metal plate should be infinite ohms.

Page 30 in the manual shows basic wiring for a stove.
As you can see one side of the elements is hard wired to L2.
The other side goes through a control relay on the board and then to L1.
Just in case you do not know about electrical I will try and explain how it works.
Your house supply is actually two 120 volt supplies that share a common ground/Neutral. They are 180 degrees out of phase. So when one is at positive 120 volts the other is at negative 120 volts, therefore there is 240 volts between them and this is the voltage that runs the elements.
Neutral is not part of the element supply voltage/current path.

On many Canadian models there is also a DLB (double line break) relay on the board. This disconnects the L2 voltage to both elements when the oven is off.

I do not thing that the bake element relay on the board is closing or it has bad relay contacts so you see the 120 from the DLB relay and not the full 240 volts across the element.

I would trace the wires from the element (both sides) back up to the board just to be sure they have not put a thermal cutoff (fuse) in one of the lines.

You could also check the solder side or the board for a bad/over heated connection.
Below is a link to a post on a unit with this type of problem.
http://forum.appliancepartspros...er-oven-not-working.html
THIS FORUM IS DEAD!!!!!!!
Dav0  
#3 Posted : Monday, March 31, 2014 9:47:31 AM(UTC)
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Dav0

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Thank you very much for getting back to me so quickly.

I did the resistance test on the element as you suggested and it did indeed cope up at around 22ohm.

I traced the two wires which connect to the element, one goes to some sort of msall relay and the other one is spliced with another wire and part of it heads up into where the timer is and the other one just connects to a terminal just above where the bake element wires go, I've attached pictures.

I've only taken the first layer of the back off, it looks like to get the whole thing off you have to take everything apart which I would like to avoid if I don't have to.

Attached photos of the back of the stove and where the bake element wires go. What should I do from here?
Dav0 attached the following image(s):
stove 1.jpg
stove 2.JPG
stove 3.JPG
stove 4.JPG
denman  
#4 Posted : Tuesday, April 1, 2014 1:50:55 AM(UTC)
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Sorry but I cannot be helpful here.

You need a wiring diagram.

I did see on one site that the unit was the same as a PLEF398AC but I cannot confirm this as the Sears Canadian parts site is pretty useless so I cannot even check if the parts on the two units are the same.

The relay that you show could be a DLB relay.
Also I do not know what the thermal switch/cut-off above the relay is for.

All I can suggest is that you try to get a wiring diagram from Sears.
THIS FORUM IS DEAD!!!!!!!
Dav0  
#5 Posted : Tuesday, April 29, 2014 11:44:31 AM(UTC)
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Dav0

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Well, been being blown off by sears for weeks now, finally they got back to me and told me they refuse to send me the diagram.

Anyone in Canada, DO NOT buy sears appliances, they have the worst customer service I have ever had the misfortune of dealing with.

So Looks like I'm going to have to figure this out without one, can someone please help me figure this out?
Dav0  
#6 Posted : Wednesday, April 30, 2014 1:34:39 PM(UTC)
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Dav0

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I tested the wires and found that the one on the left is the one not sending any power, I followed it up into the top and attached is a pic of where it goes.

I also found the wiring diagram stuffed in there so that is attached as well.
File Attachment(s):
wiring diagram.pdf (786kb) downloaded 7 time(s).
Dav0 attached the following image(s):
oven wire.jpg
denman  
#7 Posted : Thursday, May 1, 2014 5:34:37 AM(UTC)
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denman

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Sounds like the bake relay on the board is not closing or at least it's contacts are not closing.

The circuit for the bake element is L1 , Bake relay on the control board , Bake element , NC to C on the realay marked as Relay Relais 240 V. , DLB reklay contacts , L2

Sincs broil works we can assume that the DLB relay is OK as it controls bake, broil and convection elements.

Does the convection element work?
If not it may be the Relay 240 V as it switches between the Convection or the bale element. Since the Normally Closed contacts are for the bake element this would be a problem either with the relay's contacts or it is always energized.
THIS FORUM IS DEAD!!!!!!!
Dav0  
#8 Posted : Thursday, May 1, 2014 8:08:50 AM(UTC)
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Dav0

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From my test the wire on the right which goes to the little relay beside it works, it is abour 3v off and when yo turn bake on it goes to about 115v. The wire that comes down from the control panel does not seem to work, it is 2v off and when you turn bake on it goes down to about .05v, one of the convection element wires is spliced into this wire as can be see in the one photo.

If it is the control panel that needs replacing, how do I go about finding a new one?
Dav0  
#9 Posted : Thursday, May 1, 2014 10:56:08 AM(UTC)
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Dav0

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I think the part number of the clock/control panel is # 318010100 but everywhere I've looked says it is discontinued.
denman  
#10 Posted : Thursday, May 1, 2014 1:18:03 PM(UTC)
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denman

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There are places out there that fix obsolete control boards, just Google "appliance timer repair".
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