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JD40  
#1 Posted : Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:25:03 PM(UTC)
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JD40

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After self cleaning oven it will not heat up on bake or broil. I've checked the elements they have continuity no breaks or grounding there is 120 volts on both sides of each element the thermal fuse has continuity and voltage on both sides. Everything works as it should just won't heat up in oven. Stove top works normally and the panel turns on an supplies power when switched on. Any advice would be great
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denman  
#2 Posted : Wednesday, March 19, 2014 1:21:59 AM(UTC)
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denman

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A model number may help others help you.

The 120 volts (using Neutral/ground as the reference) can be misleading.

On many units one side of the elements is connected to one side of the line and so they always have 120 volts on them.
The other side of the line is then switched in by a control relay either on the control or relay board.

Check that the unit is staying in pre-heat.
If it shows that the oven is ready then it could be a oven sensor problem.
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JD40  
#3 Posted : Wednesday, March 19, 2014 5:04:26 AM(UTC)
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JD40

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Thanks for replying. The control panel does as it should as far as the display it does display preheat then goes to bake when the preheat timer goes off. As far as the voltage it does read 120 when switched on. The meter reads 120 on supply to switch then read 120 to the element once switched on. The sensor reads as it should with the meter hooked to it and goes up in readings as it gets warmer. The problem I can't get past is that when switched on I have 120 volts at both elements which I think tells me that everything that comes together to switch voltage to the element is working I may be wrong. What are the possibilities that both element are bad at the same time and are also reading good on meter
denman  
#4 Posted : Wednesday, March 19, 2014 5:14:43 AM(UTC)
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denman

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Need a model number so I can try and find the wiring diagram.
[COLOR="Blue"]
What are the possibilities that both element are bad at the same time and are also reading good on meter[/COLOR]
Very, very remote
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JD40  
#5 Posted : Wednesday, March 19, 2014 5:27:11 PM(UTC)
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JD40

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Thanks again for your advice. The model number of my whirlpool stove is GR448LXPSO.
denman  
#6 Posted : Thursday, March 20, 2014 2:09:53 AM(UTC)
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denman

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Here are your parts
Parts for Whirlpool GR448LXPS0 Range - AppliancePartsPros.com

See the attachment for the wiring diagram.

As you can see the L2 side of the line goes through a DLB relay (K5) on the board. This may be the 120 volts you see at the elements when the oven is turned on.
Of it could be from either the bake relay (K1) or the broil relay (K2).

In any case one side of the line is not being switched on when it should.

If you unplug the unit and disconnect either the NO or COM wire for the DLB relay and then plug the unit6 in and check for 120 at the elements when on.
Just be sure to tape up wire so that it cannot short to anything else.

If you still see 120 volts then you know it is the DLB relay that is not closing.
If there is no voltage then you know that the bake/broil relays are not closing.

There can be a couple reasons why relay contacts do not close:
it could be the relay contacts are shot.
It could be the relay coil is no good
It could be that the electronics that close the relay are shot.
File Attachment(s):
GR448.pdf (158kb) downloaded 11 time(s).
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JD40  
#7 Posted : Thursday, March 20, 2014 6:10:53 PM(UTC)
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JD40

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I went to the DLB relay and the NO wire at the coil was burnt black. I disconnected it and turn it on and the elements still had 120 volts on both sides. What your saying us that the DLB coil is bad? Do they sell it seperately or do I have to buy the whole control board?
JD40  
#8 Posted : Thursday, March 20, 2014 6:17:42 PM(UTC)
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JD40

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Now, with the DLB wires hooked up I only have 120 Volts on one side until I hit bake then I have 120 on both sides. I thought that meant that the relay was working because once the relay was commanded on the voltage was on both sides.
denman  
#9 Posted : Friday, March 21, 2014 1:51:44 AM(UTC)
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denman

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[COLOR="Blue"] I disconnected it and turn it on and the elements still had 120 volts on both sides. [/COLOR]
You need 240 across the element.
Perhaps a little basic electrical info will help.
The dashes are wire.
One meter lead (reference) is at Neutral/ground which is not part of the element circuit.

L1----closed relay contacts----element----closed relay contacts----L2
This would measure 120 volts on both sides of the element but one side is L1 voltage and the other side is L2 voltage.
Measuring across the element gives 240 volts.

L1----open relay contacts----element----closed relay contacts----L2
This would read 120 volts (L2 voltage) on both sides of the element.
Measuring across the element gives 0 volts.
Since there is not a complete circuit for current through the element, no current flows. There is therefore no voltage drop across the element so you see the L2 (120 volts) on both sides of the element.

L1----closed relay contacts----element----open relay contacts----L2
This would read 120 volts (L1 voltage) on both sides of the element.
Measuring across the element gives 0 volts.

The electrical supply in your house is actually two 120 volt supplies (L1 and L2) that have a common ground. The are 120 volts out of phase. In other words when one is at positive 120 volts, the other is at negative 120 volts so if you measure from L1 to L2 you get 240 volts. This is the voltage that runs the elements.

There is no way to know which side of the line (L1 or L2) when using a meter and since Neutral is not part of the heater circuit it can get confusing interpreting the results.

[COLOR="Blue"][COLOR="Blue"]What your saying us that the DLB coil is bad?[/COLOR][/COLOR]
The coil or contacts or control electronics.


[COLOR="Blue"] Do they sell it seperately or do I have to buy the whole control board?[/COLOR]
You have to buy the control board,
Another possibility is to take the relay number off of it and try to find a replacement at electronic supply places re: Digikey, ******** etc.
This would fix a contact coil problem.

[COLOR="Blue"]Now, with the DLB wires hooked up I only have 120 Volts on one side until I hit bake then I have 120 on both sides. I thought that meant that the relay was working because once the relay was commanded on the voltage was on both sides.[/COLOR]
The above post is why I put in the electrical info above because I do not know what is going on here.
All I can do is give my thoughts on it.
First you should not see any voltage at the elements with the oven off because the DLB and element control relays should be open.
You should see the 120 on both sides of the element as long as the element is OK. So the voltage when not in a heating mode stumps me.
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JD40  
#10 Posted : Friday, March 21, 2014 6:08:36 AM(UTC)
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JD40

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Thanks for the lesson I really appreciate it. I'm a car guy and not an expert at a/c voltage I know enough to get into trouble I guess. I guess I'll try a circuit board and again thank you
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