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Hi - I looked through the forum and didn't see a similar post with my symptoms. I hope someone can

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Old 12-13-2010, 04:41 PM
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Default Frigidaire Noise and Performance Issues
Model Number: PLD4375RFC   Brand: Frigidaire   Age: 1 - 5 years   

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Hi - I looked through the forum and didn't see a similar post with my symptoms. I hope someone can help me diagnose. My 2 year old DW is quiet at the start of the cycle, and starts to whine at about the 15 minute mark, sounds like it's choking on something during the recirc cycle (pump out is fine though) and continues this way through end of cycle. The bottom arm is spinning fine, but the two top arms are not moving, or moving very little. As a result, the dishes aren't clean and especially on the top rack.

Seems like there is not enough water pressure. I removed the pump and motor and it all looks fine - no obstructions, parts move freely. I can replace the motor/pump, but don't understand why things sound normal during the start of the cycle - that doesn't correlate with bad bearings which would whine continuously. If it is the motor, I would also like to understand why it failed so early in the first place.

Any ideas? What would you do (besides stay away from Frigidaire)?
Thanks you for reading!


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2010, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric J View Post
Hi - I looked through the forum and didn't see a similar post with my symptoms. I hope someone can help me diagnose. My 2 year old DW is quiet at the start of the cycle, and starts to whine at about the 15 minute mark, sounds like it's choking on something during the recirc cycle (pump out is fine though) and continues this way through end of cycle. The bottom arm is spinning fine, but the two top arms are not moving, or moving very little. As a result, the dishes aren't clean and especially on the top rack.

Seems like there is not enough water pressure. I removed the pump and motor and it all looks fine - no obstructions, parts move freely. I can replace the motor/pump, but don't understand why things sound normal during the start of the cycle - that doesn't correlate with bad bearings which would whine continuously. If it is the motor, I would also like to understand why it failed so early in the first place.

Any ideas? What would you do (besides stay away from Frigidaire)?
Thanks you for reading!

Eric,

When you removed and checked the pump, did you check and clean all the filters ?

Did you remove the cover and check the internal components for a scum or deposit build up on the parts and walls of the pump assembly ?

Did you check the "check Ball" under the cover, to see if it moved freely ?

If you have done all of that,

Start the machine, and let it run for a few minutes,
( take notice if the unit fills, and a slight pause occurs, before the motor starts.

After it fills and runs a few minutes(3 to 5) open the door, wait a few seconds, then open the door and check for the water level in the bottom of the tub, the large filter should be submerged, if you've got enough water.

A slow or low water supply(not enough water) Will give the symptoms you described and could be misinterpretted as a pump problem.

( while it is in the wash cycle and working, you may want to check the water for sudsing, sudsing will also cause a similar situation, and you may want to change detergent/ rinse additive.

Good Luck,
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Old 12-15-2010, 07:00 AM
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That was great advice. When I took the mump and motor apart earlier, I did make sure everything was clean. I was also thinking the pump might be cavitating because of the choking sound I described. I also checked to see if there was enough water and actually threw in some extra, but the pump still made noise so I discounted.

However, when I read your reply I thought I should check out this theory again. This morning I ran the dishwasher empty and without soap. It ran as quiet as the day we installed it! I noted a couple of things:

- The filter was submerged with water, barely, when filled and the drain pump ran much longer than was required to evacuate the tub. So maybe I could use more water in the tub? Is this a level or timing control? How would I adjust this?

- At about the time we noticed the pump noise, I believe the brand of detergent we were using (a Costco brand) changed their formula from the white paste to a clear gel. I have to believe that the new formula is too sudsy for our dishwasher, especially given that we have what appears to be barely enough water in the tub.

I plan to change the soap we're using. Would increasing the water level help out also?

Thanks again!
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Old 12-15-2010, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric J View Post
That was great advice. When I took the mump and motor apart earlier, I did make sure everything was clean. I was also thinking the pump might be cavitating because of the choking sound I described. I also checked to see if there was enough water and actually threw in some extra, but the pump still made noise so I discounted.

However, when I read your reply I thought I should check out this theory again. This morning I ran the dishwasher empty and without soap. It ran as quiet as the day we installed it! I noted a couple of things:

- The filter was submerged with water, barely, when filled and the drain pump ran much longer than was required to evacuate the tub. So maybe I could use more water in the tub? Is this a level or timing control? How would I adjust this?

- At about the time we noticed the pump noise, I believe the brand of detergent we were using (a Costco brand) changed their formula from the white paste to a clear gel. I have to believe that the new formula is too sudsy for our dishwasher, especially given that we have what appears to be barely enough water in the tub.

I plan to change the soap we're using. Would increasing the water level help out also?

Thanks again!

Eric,

There's not anything you can do to adjust the water level, other than replacing the fill valve and checking and flushing the water supply line to the dishwasher,

Part number: AP3958724

Part number: AP3958724


The "water level" switch is more of a "safety" switch, should the dishwasher have more than adequate water pressure, and fills too fast the float will lift and open the switch, shutting power off to the fill valve.

Then your control board, is pre programmed to allow so many seconds(usually 90 seconds) to fill to the proper water level and shut the fill valve off.

In short,

If you have good water pressure, the water level switch will open, and the water valve shuts off, there should be a pause(for the remainder of the fill time of the control board) then the motor starts and runs.

If you have a low water pressure/slow fill situation, the float wont activate, the control will go through the 90 second fill cycle and start the motor ,without enough water to properly pressurize the pump, and wash properly.

As for detergent usage,

I've always reccomended, and use a Plain (no additives) powderred detergent,

and a rinse agent, with the dispenser setting on low to medium,(if you have an adjustable rinse aid dispenser).

As long as the water is 120 dgrs. on the first fill of the wash cycle, and you do not have hard water(12 grains or above) everything will be fine.

Good Luck,
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Old 12-18-2010, 04:49 AM
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Quick Update:

I went back to powder soap - and all of the noise and performance issues went away. Hard to believe.

I still think the tub is not filling as it should, possibly there is debris in the fill line or at the DW valve (do these valves have inlet screens?). When I am motivated, I will pull out and check things out.

For now, we have a working dishwasher!
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Old 12-20-2010, 06:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric J View Post
Quick Update:

I went back to powder soap - and all of the noise and performance issues went away. Hard to believe.

I still think the tub is not filling as it should, possibly there is debris in the fill line or at the DW valve (do these valves have inlet screens?). When I am motivated, I will pull out and check things out.

For now, we have a working dishwasher!

Eric,

Great,

Glad to hear you're up and running somewhat properly.

Yes,

The fill valve does have a debris screen, but you'd have to dismantle the fill valve, to clean the screen properly, and flush the water supply line.

Like they say"time is money" so you'd save some by the cleaning process,

Good Luck,

Happy Holidays,

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